Born into a trip

2 years, 3 months ago

What do you all think would happen if there was an experiment preformed in which we constantly inject a newborn baby with psychedelics for lets say 18 years. I’m not considering the science of how we would keep this person alive, but lets say it’s possible to keep them healthy physically.

A few questions to think about:

Would life for them be just as “normal” as for us, would they be in a constant state of awe, or just experiencing a different realm of consciousness?

When we stop the chemicals, they would come into reality as we know it. Would this just be like a trip to them? Like a reversal of what we experience?

What could we learn? This person would have NO common experiences with other humans, lets say we taught them to communicate, what could they tell us about how they experienced life for 18 years?

We can even take this topic further and say that maybe in the future all humans will be born this way, matrix style.
How about the possibility that this is already true, and life as we know it is just a trip we are experiencing.

December 9, 2012 at 2:40 am

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Profile photo of Alex Alex (@staylucky) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

I was going to start off by saying how ridiculous this is, but the more I read the more fascinating I found it. Obviously from an ethical standpoint it has little to no hope in hell of happening, but for the perspective of simply questioning what it would be like I think you raise some very interesting points.

I think it would probably lead to depression and anxiety. There’s a reason people get hooked on drugs after all. They can be better than reality!

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Profile photo of  Anonymous (@) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

What makes you think that is not what is happening to you right now?

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Profile photo of Alex Alex (@staylucky) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@arenotlost, Well in that case my government has a shitty fucking dealer.

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Profile photo of  Anonymous (@) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@staylucky, Haha your last comment was great!

It’s fun to poke around with the idea… This universe is pretty cool, why couldn’t it be a trip? I say it’s not because a psychedelic trip seems to be an individually created place (I haven’t had the opportunity to try any psychedelics yet… so I’m not the best to argue this) and our universe is so based on other people’s experiences and teachings. OR IS IT!? Bum bum bummmmmmm

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Profile photo of Martijn Schirp Martijn Schirp A (@martijn) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

I know that some indegenious tribes give their children a low dose of ayahuasca or other ‘child’ psychedelic plants for them to make a connection to the underworld/spirit animals etc.

Btw: how do you know for a fact everyone experience is the same right now?

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Profile photo of  Anonymous (@) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@martijn, Well it’s not, nobody has the same experience, but mostly it’s based off of how you were raised and other social factors. I’m sure somewhere in the world someone was born weird and is experiencing what I just described because of a chemical imbalance in the brain, people in the looney bin of course have different perceptions of life. The problem is, we can’t learn much about it because We gotta heal them folks of der illnessess and make em proper citizens, or keep em shut in the cages!!

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Profile photo of  Anonymous (@) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@martijn, Any chance you have a good link about those tribes? I think that’s really interesting!

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Profile photo of David David (@alexunknown) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

It’s interesting how I was thinking exactly the same, but in a reverse motion! Have you ever stopped and observed the glance on a stoned newbie person? That trip is so new for them, they’re admiring everything that happens around them! The way they see, hear, feel, taste, smell… The way they appreciate the world is totally new for them! It’s a way so new they are trying not to lose a single detail of it, and as they keep on smoking through time, they already know how to move on this new reality: they know which music they like to hear, they know which topics they like to think about, they like specific kinds of food, they feel and respond to specific stimulations, and so on…
Have you ever seen the glance of a newborn when you’re giggling and smiling and playing with him/her? That exact same glance of knowing a new world, a new experience! They never knew how to see or WHAT seeing is, they just instinctively open their eyes and let their brains receive all of that unknown information. They don’t know what a sound “sounds like” or behaves, they just know something happened with that applause, but still don’t know what the fuck happened! For them, EVERY-FUCKING-THING is totally UNKNOWN. They’re experience on this world on this life is one huge fucking trip they just get used to through time, and as they grow, they start knowing what they feel happy about, what music harmonizes the best with them, what activities satisfy them, what topics they like to think about. I’m not saying that life is like eating one big fucking shroom, nor I’m comparing a stone-head with something as pure as a baby, all I wanna do is emphasize the expression in their faces when nothing they are experiencing they have never done before. For me, at least, it’s pretty amazing!

Now, to truly answer your question with my opinion, I think that would be one interesting fucking thing to do and, in the case we could hold the mental and physical health of the baby, I would have loved it to be me the one with that experience. Imagine all the things that person would have seen in 18 years! Imagine that, after a huge while of being dozed and get used to it as a normal kind of life, every thought and every way of thinking that person has, every single thing he or she could share with the rest of the mortals after he or she learned to communicate with us!

And yes, I totally believe our form of experiencing life is one huge kind of trip we are just used to and that we know how to take throughout time. I dunno, maybe if we were born in a stoned-like perception kind of life and we smoked some anti-cannabis that altered our perception of reality into this normal one, maybe we would be pretty amazed at what we experience right now, being every perception as we totally know them right now, totally unknown, having a crave and a desire to explore the hell out of it!

What makes this even more interesting is that we are talking about someone who would’ve been dozed for 18 FUCKING YEARS!!!!! And if that ain’t enough, he or she had been stopped being dozed all of a sudden! If we could avoid every health issue about it, we would be talking about a person with a dual consciousness! And what we would consider as an alter-consciousness could be so vast, from every type of doze or drug we know, from the ever sweet, relaxing, profound cannabis to the hallucinating mushrooms, without even mentioning the infinite combinations between them. Imagine yourself in a reality where all the things you see with mushrooms where totally normal and you even found a logic and a way to deal with that reality everyday, and all of a sudden… BOOM!! Welcome motherfucker, now you’re in OUR reality!
…. If insanity doesn’t kill you, you would be able to transport what you, for 18 years, considered to be logic and try to apply it to this logic… Are you even capable to assimilate the advances or alternatives to art, philosophy and maybe even science?!?!? I genuinely think it would be similar to a window or a door to another string on the strings theory! (…. Ok, maybe I let myself fly too high with that one, but think about it for a minute and tell me if that wouldn’t be like a portal to some-fucking-where else not yet explored by human beings!) Maybe he would’ve experienced the sight of a totally new color, or feelings thousands of times stronger than love, or maybe he would complement so well with this one reality he would have sudden realizations related to the meaning of life or the origins of the universe!

Sounds crazy I know, but think that humans tend to consider crazy all of that we do not comprehend or can not yet see, and since we are talking about someone who is totally seeing and comprehending everything we consider just a small trip!

Fascinating theme for me I should say, just in case it wasn’t clear enough! :P

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Profile photo of Martijn Schirp Martijn Schirp A (@martijn) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@frustratedpanda, I read it in Michael Harner’s ‘the way of the shaman’. No references unfortunately. Maybe you can contact him or the institute he founded and get some more information?

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Profile photo of Matthew Matthew (@ojai) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

CONSTANTLY inject them with psychedelics for 18 years? From the day they are born until 18 years old?

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-QoPQxqRo12I/T9ENZ5ub9eI/AAAAAAAAC0U/AOzcdRF3GOE/s640/Neil-deGrasse-Tyson-gif.gif

I can’t imagine what that would be like. I mean, I think the person(s) involved would probably become institutionalized as a mental patient. Think about that…imagine tripping everyday via these people or beings (who the fuck knows how you would percieve the world, they could be gods in your world) injecting you with this thing and making you trip. Then all of a sudden your world just changes…very dramatically. I just don’t see how this person could “fit in” in todays society. Who’s to say they wouldn’t just keep on tripping? I don’t know. Incredible to think about, though.

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Profile photo of  Anonymous (@) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@alexunknown, Same here, love the topic, there’s so much to hypothesize about it!

There are negative effects though, not being on a chemical could be torturous to them, like having a really bad migraine or something.

Also we could think about maybe simmering it down a little, just have this person on moderate dose of cannabis, and raise them to think it’s normal but they still integrate with society. Like your anti-cannabis idea, everyone suddenly is just like HAHA jk, you’ve actually been high this whole time, let’s show you what it’s like to be normal.

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Profile photo of  Anonymous (@) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@ojai, The goal wouldn’t be for them to fit in, it would be more of an experiment.
I think that so much shit would have happened to them they would be used to going into many streams of consciousness, and they would see coming off the trip as just the next part of the ride they are on. We could never convince them that what’s happening now is different than what’s happened to them for the past 18 years. I imagine it would be sort of like inception.

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Profile photo of cadeus cadeus (@cadeus333) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@frustratedpanda, Interesting topic, I’ll have to mull this over for a bit.

Thanks for sharing :)

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Profile photo of cadeus cadeus (@cadeus333) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@frustratedpanda, After my most profound psychedelic experiences (D.M.T. and 5 grams of mushrooms) I found that all of my perceptions about myself and the world had changed incredibly. These changed perceptions have lasted until today and, I think I am changed for life and for the better.

I think someone born into these perceptions and altered sates would be absolutely unable to adjust to any “normal” society or culture. It would be too much to handle, whether they thought it was “real” or not. Seeing the evil of the world would just be too much to handle, they would wish they had never seen it and probably write it off as not being “reality”.

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Profile photo of cadeus cadeus (@cadeus333) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

@alexunknown, That is a very interesting take on it, thank you for sharing :)

I love seeing that look in the newbies. “It’s a brave new world buddy” lol.

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Profile photo of cadeus cadeus (@cadeus333) 2 years, 3 months ago ago
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Profile photo of  Anonymous (@) 2 years, 3 months ago ago

The US gov’t did something similar back when LSD was discovered – people were given LSD on a daily basis and basically never allowed to be sober.

” in April, 1953, experiments included administering LSD to mental patients, prisoners, drug addicts and prostitutes, “people who could not fight back”, as one agency officer put it.[33] In one case LSD was administered to a mental patient in Kentucky for 174 days.[33] LSD was also administered to CIA employees, military personnel, doctors, other government agents, and members of the general public in order to study their reactions.”

Off topic but jesus fucking christ:

http://www.homepagedaily.com/Pages/article7800-the-cias-5-most-mind-blowing-experiments-with-lsd.aspx

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/7415082/French-bread-spiked-with-LSD-in-CIA-experiment.html

Now, none of these answer your question.

I would say that no they would not “adapt” to normality like those of us who depend on serotonin as our main communicator. I would expect, that on some level they would develop some seriously debilitating mental problems simply because our brains have evolved to use serotonin, and simply the excess of LSD in the mind would have some side-effects, since we probably do not have very efficient enzymes to break down LSD (hence why such a small amount is so powerful).

I would think, though, that if you took them off the LSD after a few years, they would probably shit their pants (to put it mildly) that this is in fact how everyone else sees the world.

This could be the most cruel trick in the entire world, or perhaps the most alleviating feeling anyone could ever experience, I have no idea.

But yeah, they would be radically different than you or I, they would NOT see the world like you or I, and when they became “sober” it would be one fucking hell of a trip.

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