Can a M/F relationship ever be completely paltonic? Poll.
I vote NO.
My theory (from experience) is that in every instance:
if one of the two were completely honest, he or she would agree to have sex with the other.
If you claim that you have been in a relationship where this is not true then I assert that YOU were the one that did not wish to have sex.
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@toniolo, and that is where I say then they probably have stronger feelings for you, b/c you are the one in a satisfying relationship. Now let me be clear about this I am not talking about a low level friend. I am talking about male and female that chum around spending their day together.
If your profile pic is a picture of you, I am willing to bet that your girl-friends would like to get with you physically…sorry.
@bevuhlee, Thank you for the perspective of sexual attraction as healthy. I realize that my discussion does categorize, but at times I feel we must learn how do deal with the here and now before we can deal with more lofty issues or enlightened ones. Furthermore, I feel that the idea of a platonic relationship between two similarly attractive and aged individuals is nearly always at a intimacy/attraction imbalance. I hope those involved in this forum reevaluate some relationships so the issue can be addressed before friendships are ruined or hearts are hurt.
@manimal, thanks again for engaging with me in a respectful way. I will concede to your point. I believe for you it is true and something that you strive for. Just be careful about those that my worship your self-control and fool themselves into thinking that they are able to block out lustful yet entirely human emotions.
@cadeus333, and respectfully this is exactly what I mean. With best intentions from both of you, a strong and honest relationship platonic relationship eventually sours. To me it seems that at first the age difference was a big deal, but as she has matured and your relationship has grown so too have the feelings romantically on her side.
I would go as far to say it is almost human nature.
I am friends with some girls– but this chasm always needed to be discussed in the open before we could be hurt by one another and then decided whether rebuilding into a genuine platonic relationship was possible/desirable.
rather than being platonic, or weighed down by the boundaries of “romanticism” or “sexuality,” in a situation where you have a close friend of the opposite sex, mutually discuss safe sex, and both feel the need for the heat of another body (be for loneliness or sexual urges), then just get your rocks off and continue your friendship and lives.
and don’t dramatize it into something more. sex and “selective mating” is natural.
if it’s not that situation, then any other confusion comes from the fact that people have become very abstract with the application of “platonic,” “friendship,” and “relationship.” Or rather, think so hard on the applications of such, they no longer feel the concept in their hearts.
@manimal, oh and a couple of links to the Gandhi info. Not saying I buy into it either, his Autobiography has been one of the most influential books in my life but….
Completely? Hmmm no, I guess. But yes, in that you can be sexually attracted to someone and decide not to have sex with them. Sexual attraction doesn’t always lead to sex. If it did…well some people just wouldn’t get anything done.
@possiblehubris I think yes. I have many friends that are girls. Some more attractive than others and I’m obviously sexually attracted to any woman who’s beautiful. But I believe friendships should run deeper than any primal urges to have sex. I’ve actually had this conversation with two of my female friends about how we’re both sexually attracted to one another but realize its not worth it to ruin the relationship we currently have. If it’s about sex, find a fuck buddy. It’s much harder to find a person who shares the same values and worldview than it is to find a one night stand, regardless if that person is male or female.
@manimal, And see I used to believe this. I have studied self-control and experimented with Gandhi’s practice of Brahmacharya– but even he became a victim of lust as has been revealed in more recent biographies. So I know of the higher ideal of which you speak and I support it in theory but only in practice on extremely rare cases where both people are enlightened to that end. However, if this was the case then why would two people be lying together?
I think I would buy in to an asexual argument more. Because in the case of Gandhi one could argue that in his sexual experiments he did not have lustful thoughts, but I what of the young girl that he was bathing or lying with?
The only time I could really see a M/F relationship being truly purely platonic, is in the case of an apprentice/master relationship. Something where age and expertise are way too big of an influence.
Kind of cool when that can happen too. Some of the best things I’ve ever learned were from older males whom I was close with but not at all in any kind of romantic or sexual way–too big of a gap to even contemplate, was a non issue.
So it can happen, with big gaps in age and experience/wisdom/intellect.
Maybe it’s not just attraction that’s the issue. Maybe it’s more of a young people thing, when you’re just really not sure of what you want, what you’re attracted to, who you are yourself…etc. So everyone experiments.
It does suck when someone doesn’t want to experiment with you though, but alas, there are plenty of fish in the sea.
On another note, even though one might want to sleep with the other, that’s a very primal instinct. And it doesn’t always mean love or anything like that either.
I have lots of close male friends, and maybe they want to fuck me and sometimes it’s funny to joke about, but they know it’s just a thought. I mean people in their 20s and 30s are around a lot of reproductively healthy people. It’s normal to want to have sex with your attractive friends. But you don’t have to act on it. Doesn’t change the friendships at all, it just is.
@possiblehubris, I was poking fun at your username.
An obvious counterexample to your claim would be a friendship between a homosexual male and a homosexual female.
Just as you probably aren’t attracted to every woman you see (are you heterosexual? add “and man” to that statement if you aren’t), the general idea can be applied to others, no matter what their sexual orientation is.
@toniolo, and these two girls you addressed the issue with are in committed relationships? If no, what stops you from taking it to a physical relationship…I am not longer single but it seems like the nature progression.
@citygirl9050, Nah, we haven’t hung out one on one for a while. Last time I saw her was a few weeks after my daughter was born. There have only been two of these weird conversations, one on the phone and one on fb. My wife doesn’t know any of this, I’m not trying to hide anything from her and She’s not the jealous type at all, it’s just not a conversation I want have. I just have to talk to my friend and clear the air for both of our sakes.
@possiblehubris, no, i tried but it NEVER worked, the other person is hurt that you don’t want to make the commitment to go further than just friends, BUT later on the feeling can die, and then you can have a platonic relationship, but maybe the feeling comes back again, i did not experience that (yet) from either my or the other person..you can however agree on a platonic relationship meaning you won’t do anything with your feelings towards the other person, that could work fine actually, because you only consider the person as being attractive, that doesn’t mean you want to jump on him or her all the time, you CAN control it if you choose to do so..unless you really really see this person as something special eg you’re in love with him or her. Then it would be just torture to act platonic lol.