Hello all, this is my first post so I hope I’m using this accurately. A good friend of mine told me about this site and I appreciate what it’s about. Pleasure to meet you in advance.
There are two ways to trust someone, right? Trust until it’s broken, or wait for them to gain your trust. How do I trust? Keeping a balance between the two?
I have always been a trusting person, almost too trusting of others. It’s gotten me hurt, cheated on, and taken advantage of. Through bad relationships, broken friendships, selfishness, and lies, I’ve learned to have almost no hope in trusting anyone… sometimes even my family.
Is it right for me to feel this way? To always hope for the best but expect the worst in people? How do I fully trust my new girlfriend without thinking insecurely (that she’s keeping her options open, willing to leave if she meets someone new/better, etc.)? When can I feel comfortable and be worry-free about her or anyone I surround myself with? Is this realistic of me or pessimistic?
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Trust someone a little and then see what they do with it.
Often, when people break your trust it’s because you’ve given them a responsibility that they can’t handle. Why isn’t your girlfriend worried that you might be keeping your options open and will be willing to leave if someone better comes along? If you are relying on her for your self-worth or your self-esteem, that is a responsibility that it is not fair to put on someone else.
Good luck with all that… I think you’ll figure it out. :)
This is a good thread. I read the posts. I think I grasp what it is being discussed. I just trust people because it takes less energy than harboring distrust. I’d like to use that energy on the things in my control. There may be better reason to do it but that’s the main one I’ve thought about.
I think to trust fully, you have to know that even if someone hurts you, you’ll be ok. Which, like was said by a couple people earlier, means trusting in yourself ultimately. You take away from meaningful interactions and connections by intellectualizing and sizing up the person involved’s “trustability”.
Would you rather enjoy your time with someone while you have it and possibly get hurt in the end, but know you got the most out of it that you could? Or spend valuable time with them worrying and most likely creating a problem that ends up being the end of the relationship?(and most likely regretting it for a while after).
first off, given what I can take from what you said….seems like you’ve had a hard life, wih that said insecurity is only natural and you should not beat yourself up over it. since you obviously want to feel secure enough to trust people, you have to first bolster your confidence, truly believe that you can “handle whatever they could throw at you”, which will no doubt take some time but it’ll be worth it in the end. and again, it is ok to be guarded as long as you arent emotionally unavailable to your new girlfriend or whoever else you encounter.
all this said, you’ll be ok and as long as you believe that you are strong enough to deal with the possibility of heartache, you can grow to trust others again
Trust comes from within your self. To be trusting of others is to be trustful of your self. Have confidence in your instinct and let go of your bad habits. Surround yourself only with people you love. You don’t have to trust everyone.
If you never lose your honesty, you have no fear of losing trust.
You can only trust or distrust yourself, although most people fool themselves into thinking they do it to eachother. Always trust, that’s it. There is no method, you just do it. It’s as simple as it gets.
Not trusting is fear, nothing but fear. VERY irrational fear, of pointless things. Yeah, you may get your feelings hurt, boohoo, it’s a fucking good thing. Stop clinging to your whiny ego, stop protecting it. Start living.
You can trust someone to the fullest if you know/understand them to the fullest. If you can answer ‘yes’ to the fact that you know/understand your girlfriend, then you do trust her. Its just the past that keeps your trust issues lingering. Its hard to let go of the past because you have probably been so hurt and broken, but allowing yourself to trust her, is allowing you to move on.
It’s right there in the post you claimed to agree with. “There is no method.” Haha, this is hilarious.
Also, there’s nothing genuine about such behaviour. Reaction seeking, egocentric and fearful is what it really is.
I trust, completely. Not through some bullshit method, and there is no justification needed for trust. If you don’t trust, you lack confidence and positivity, this is bad for you and for those in your proximity. As long as you don’t trust you have no real confidence and you are in fear.
What do you mean “play well with others?” If you mean collaboration, I’m very good at it. If you mean social stuff, well I seem to be quite good at that too considering all the people at my side. What exactly do you mean and what do you base that assumption on?
I do not describe the world negatively, I would never do that. There is nothing to be careful about, careful is just another word for scared and distrustful.
@Tine there are no contradiction on my side, only on yours.
You do not trust completely at all if that’s how you do it. You don’t even know what trusting completely is if that’s how you do it. You have no idea.
How do you know who to trust? Just trust. The only person you’re doubting is yourself.
No screening process is required, and that’s not foolish at all. The foolish thing to do is to screen for “trustworthiness.” That’s nothing but fear and weakness.
Say a woman who trusts completely, like you said, needs help holding her baby – she gives it to some random man on the street, and because she trusts completely, she trusts him.
Okay, man kills the baby, sad story end.
Seems like I’m reading too literally, but you can you perhaps elaborate a little bit? Unless of course, this is what your concept of all trusting condones?
@Tine That’s the whole problem. “I do not think…” That’s exactly why you’re wrong. It’s all belief, no reference and no actual knowledge of the facts. I’m speaking from experience and action, you’re not. All you have is theories, you live in a false idea of reality.
I would like to hear what Manimal has to say about trust. I think of myself as a trusting person, trusting blindly almost, I believe in the innate goodness of people; I don’t gauge/test their trustworthyness either. I basically use my gut feeling. Although I think I understand the kind of trust you (@manimal) is talking about, maybe you could give me an example. Like: a person comes into your life, do you trust this person immediately? and what does trust entail for you?
@Damasias If a person comes into my life this person is trusted. I do not actively do anything, trust isn’t something you do, it’s something that happens automatically unless your ego gets in the way. There are no criteria for this trust, neither do I have any expectations. I don’t resist what is, I go with the flow, and so I trust fully. By the act of resisting -ever so slightly- what is, you take away the trust. If you did trust there would be no reason for you to intervene, to distrust, to make criteria for “trust” and so on. Trust and confidence go hand in hand, you can’t have one without the other.
This being said, don’t read into it too much. Don’t get stuck on definitions, because they’re like the finger pointing to the moon. Experience is what it’s all about, otherwise you’ll end up with odd definitions and nothing to back em up, no real feeling or experience.
@Tine No, then you’re seeking a result. You’re still trying to intellectually justify or seek a reason for trusting or whatever. There is no real trust in doing that.
It’s a completely different state of mind, that’s why a lot of people can’t seem to understand these things. This is the way people are conditioned these days, and it’s a huge problem, especially for the individual that is conditioned this way. Stop looking for the answers and results, and start living the questions and actions, begin in the right end.
Trying to predict and control the future isn’t healthy, resisting what is will only make you miserable. Go with the flow, use the force.
i think it what kind of vibe you give off.
manimal it is easy for you to trust cuz you give a strong vibe and no one is going to walk over you. or even try. so it is easy for you to trust.
for me and others like tine i guess, we have a softer vibe and it is easier to find holes in our story. bullys can see this and walk in and stamp on us.
it happens to me time after time, and then i try each time to say ok next time im not going to get walked on, im not going to trust anyone until i feel safe. but i have such an open and generous nature that it happens before i can put up a defense.not every time, but still too often.
manimal my guess is that never happens to you.
question now.. how do we change these patterns. perhaps manimal can give us some tips on that!
@Tine I only think about the why when I set course, then I just roll with it. I have no idea what spawned the thought process, and it doesn’t matter.
@stonedragon Do I trust because of my vibe, or do I have my vibe because I trust? Think about that one for a while…
@Tine It’s the process I have in general. And I don’t have much of an idea of trust, ideas about things like these only seem to diffuse one’s vision and make one chase illusions.
“Well, telling others how you arrived at the conclusions, the thoughts and ideas that led to the epiphany, is really the only way we can fully understand what you mean”
Not at all. It’s about experience, not understanding someone’s words. Moon-pointing-finger-etc again. As for the definitions, forget the definitions. Finger and moon yet again.
@stonedragon Well, kind of. But if people are such asswipes, why should that affect you and not the other way around?
@Tine WTH no!! Not at all. There is no “how much I trust,” I just trust. My trust isn’t betrayed. Why would I betray it?
yes indeed manimal spell it out.
you say you dont get wiped out cuz you trust.
and i say the asswipes see you are tough as a lion and they run when they see you. so only the nice guys approuch you and dont betray you cuz you are fierce.
now tine how is it that you and me get wiped out one time in two…..
we also trust . that is not the point here. trusting or not.
it is how we come across. like suckers or people that refuse to be walked over..
@Tine I can’t remember him ever stealing from me, and I don’t imagine such scenarios. Why would I do that? And if someone does something bad I do not trust less. (lol i could trust him to be bad, you know jk) I don’t let anyone (or anything exterior for that matter) get to me, my deep state remains unshaken. I’m at peace. Trust is a fundamental core characteristic, it should be a cause and not an effect.
@stonedragon I doubt there’s anyone who runs when they see me. I get approached by a lot of dickbags. But I don’t give them any power.
tine i start to understand you more now. it is as if you grew from the asswipe into the trustworthy guy that understands the asswipes and is there for cautious of them.
that is indeed a wise progression. you should be therefore qualified to advice the gentleman who posted this question.
and manimal. why are you so trusting then. what happens to you when you get walked on. or does that not happen. do you never break your heart. you have said that many times. that it is just ego. etc. that means nothing to me.
i get my heart broken so much. and everytime i fall into the trap/
both of you guys can teach me something here.
@Tine Sounds a lot like my past too. But being a mean, deceptive, manipulative douchebag taught me how these people are. I can almost smell it, it’s easy to notice if people have an agenda. That doesn’t mean distrusting them is right, you just shouldn’t give them the opportunities to abuse you. It takes two people for that to happen. And by being proactive and assertive and confident (trusting) a lot of people will be forced into being trustworthy around you.
@stonedragon There is no why. The trust is a cause, not an effect. If someone walks over me I’ll just shrug em off, no big deal. Everyone gets walked on every now and then, there’s no reason to get upset, it’s just something that happens. Either you’re at peace with the world, or you’re resisting what is, and all negative emotion comes from the latter one.
manimal that is alot to think about there. for me it makes sence what you said. ‘you shouldnt give them opportunites to abuse you]
that is my problem
last winter i had a guy come and want to rent my small house, next door. i told him the terms over and over and how much he was gonna have to pay for the gas. and then i trusted him. we even signed a paper, not legal but a paper.
then i had an operation on my ankle and couldnt walk all winter, and he knew that i was stuck in the house.
so he never paid the rent, or the gas and left when i was finally able to walk. so i couldnt catch him.
no big deal , just about 2000 euro. but it pisses me off. but now i rented out again to another guy and he is sweet and i trust him and he pays me. so i dont stop trusting either. but i get burned.
it is all in the attitude i figured out. i have to not attract bullys to me. stop being the soft woman victum.
HOW to trust must be in your ATTITUDE….
The act of pulling away from someone who is harming you due to a pattern they have demonstrated that clearly shows why they are around you, is what I mean by “Trusting Less”.
tine give me an example of this…. i dont understand what you mean here. is it in terms of personal relationships?
ellie i think what yo said here really awnsers the type of question that the guy who started this discussion was asking. it is in regard to a personal relationship not the kind of general trusting like i am referring to. and i agree with you , but i feel also that after 30 years of marriage and a cheating husband who i actually never trusted that the whole story sucks for me.
this trusting issue is a sore point for me, and one i have not much grip on as yet. you ask.
Would you rather enjoy your time with someone while you have it and possibly get hurt in the end, but know you got the most out of it that you could?|
i say yes. in fact i did get the most out of the whole thing i could have. i learned a whole lot and lived a huge amount of experiences, i loved him and still do, and had three amazing kids. yes ellie the awnser is yes.
@Tine I think that story is a proof of what Manimal was saying. You were THINKING about trusting him…. when you should have been FEELING. Thinking he was ur friend was the problem. I bet you could feel that there was something wrong, but ignored it on account of what you thought. Would you agree?
@tine Good story bro! (and I mean it). I understand better now where you’re coming from. Makes me sad to see how badly people use friendship and credulousness of someone else. People that don’t have their primary needs met, will go well out of their way to get it. He had a motive and it wasn’t exactly only friendship. I know these “Matts”. You can feel in your gut something is off, but they somehow manage to make you feel bad if you don’t let them into your home, for example by evoking feelings of compassion etc.
I’m not sure but maybe you can avoid such situations in the future by saying “no” to people you feel there’s something off about them? (I see this movie in my mind where telling this Mattperson instead of coming in: Nah I’m not feeling it, my gut tells me you’re not actually my friend, sorry!)
Eventhough you experienced all of this, do you harbour a slight feeling of distrust now to anyone you meet ?
I don’t quite know what to say here :) Ummm I don’t trust anyone. When I try to explain this to people they think it sounds cold….but it’s not. I tell you I’m one of the warmest people you’d ever meet in your life. I think in not placing ‘trust,’ I’m freeing anyone from any sort of burden (however tiny it may be) of ‘having to live up to something I expect from them.’
This isn’t bc I’ve been burned (well I have a few times, but that’s not why)…or am afraid of anything. I don’t see the need to.. at all? I think in placing trust in something you’re placing some sort of artificial obligation on it/them, you’re making things more complicated than they need to be. I think in a way, trust = expectation. I don’t have expectations. (Christ has anyone read the 4 agreements?!)
I once heard a story about the right lessons to learn when someone betrays your trust…
There were once two students walking down a forest path on their way back to their monastery (yep its a fable). On their way, an old man blocked the path. He called the two young students over, pretending to need help.
Once they were near him, he pulled out a sword and demanded all their money. He was really a bandit in disguise.
The two robbed students made it back to the monastery and told their teacher their tale, distressed. Their teacher asked them what they had learned from the experience.
The first replied that he had learned to never trust strangers. He was sent away from the monastery to find a different life.
The second replied that he had learned to expect the unexpected. He stayed for many more years.
What do you guys think of this story? I think the moral is good – you shouldn’t learn that strangers aren’t to be trusted, maybe you should simply learn that you were more vulnerable than you thought you were.
And in the meantime I think it’s good to keep an eye out, like you Tine :)
One of my friends has recently started ruminating upon the idea that everyone thinks everyone else is an idiot unless they agree with them. I personally don’t accept that statement because you can disagree with someone in one area, yet still respect them as a whole. I think the former kind of goes along with mistrust in a way that you can’t be certain if someone is worthy of your opinion of what it trustworthy. However, I still do not trust anyone for the fact that I am not certain if they are living in the same reality as I. Does my opinion on trust conflict with my opinion on friends’ statement?
…PHEW. A lot to take in. I appreciate the passion and time you guys have all spent.
If I were to dumb it down into ONE long sentence from what I think you all are trying to say…
“Trust away, but be cautious of the intent and nature of others (what I feel from @Tine) and to also, in the end, not let it get to you / not care if someone distrusts you, that it’s just a part of life. (what I feel from @Manimal).
Does this seem right?
@peddyjoonam, I think people meant, trust. You’ll either get what you expected (in this case-good for you, you got what you wanted) or you’ll end up hurt and if you do, it’s good- you’ll learn from it. In other words, live life with all its shit.