My friend was trying to explain how in the Christian religion they believe Jesus “Died for our sins.” Now I don’t understand this, usually when someone dies FOR something they’re dying for something good. For example; Soldiers die to protect certain rights, freedom and people. So to me it would make more sense if Jesus dyed FOR the goodness of all. Am i making sense? Can someone explain this to me.
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@manimal, Just because you don’t believe in a particular religion does not mean it is retarded. I think we can all relate to the main theme throughout most religions which is to become a better person. If you actually read the bible it is one continuous story which has hundreds if not thousands of valuable lessons for life. Sure, it has some contradictions in it but that doesn’t take away the value of the knowledge that is there. It’s kind of annoying how people dismiss religion as useless bullshit because of a few contradictions. I’m not saying you should become a christian, I’m just saying you shouldn’t dismiss the value of christianity even if it isn’t true.
The only real point in Christianity and the Bible is not a whole mumbo jumbo about ego, it is just about intent. You will do the wrong thing often, but what is your intent? Simple.
There are a hell of a lot of ways to interpret stories in the Bible: I think the story of Adam and Eve is about concepts, the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and bad, it is eaten. This means the abilities of concept, design of our own values, taking concept in so that it becomes our identity. Concepts have their place as a tool to improve things but Adam and Eve made it more than what it is supposed to be, our identity, that it is all we really are, but it is not.
As a result we have all the sins because concept is misused and is at the root of all things injurious. However if concept is used correctly, it becomes the tree of life.
But as I said, that is a bunch of hoohah, it is all and only about our intent, we have no choice but to sin but we do have power over our intent, to be of malice or to apply it appropriately.
@lifetimeclimber, I don’t believe in ANY religion, because they’re ALL bullshit.
The theme of religion is to become a better person? Haha. Haha. This.. is hilarious.
That’s just bigotry, feeding your ego some bullshit about being a better person than others. Lame.
That’s exactly the weakness that religions exploit to make people submit, that’s what it’s really all about, making people submit.
I’ve read the bible thrice. Doesn’t change the fact that it’s all bullshit.
It’s not at all one continuous story, it’s a ton of short stories.
And they’re all born from misconceptions. Idiots who read the ancient holy texts and misinterpreted/distorted it beyond recognition, turned it into a fuckin fairytale when it was originally about real stuff that works.
But, by all means, cling to your rotten ship if you want to. Doesn’t harm me. In fact, it makes things a lot easier for me if people cling to idiotic beliefs and general delusion, although I detest that shit.
Wow, I don’t assign to religion, I don’t think it is needed. The only value I see is for introspection, that you can see the logic and benefit in interacting with people in the most appropriate way, whatever that may mean to you. But so many people are so jaded by religion, hostile reactions to what you claim is so pointless, if you really believe religion is so irrelevant then you could objectively discuss it rather than out bursting in a bias view.
The fact is religion is NOT irrelevant because so many people assign to one incarnation or another and they are passionate about it, and most of the rest of people so passionately respond against it. It seems it is relevant to all, as I see it.
@iambrian, Trying to make sense of this is a lost cause. The term ‘died for our sins’ im pretty sure is a misinterpretation of the original texts. But it sounds dramatic enough right? Curious that Christians seem to care more about the death of Jesus than all the beautiful lessons of love he taught while living.
The way I was taught as a child, as well as my adult understanding today, lead me to this. Eve was the first human to commit sin by eating the forbidden fruit. God cast Adam and Eve out of the garden of Eden, and humankind was forced to live harsh lives and struggle with temptation. Those who were victorious, for the most part, would be admitted to heaven, those who were not, to hell (with a few in the gray area that wait in purgatory). Jesus, as Christians believe, was the Messiah, whose purpose in life was to give his own life so that we may be free from sin. In the three days between Jesus’ death and resurrection, he guided all the souls in hell up to heaven, opening the gates to all people and, therefore, saving us from our sins.
@rstevehardy, My first comment is not an opinion, that is exactly what “Jesus died for our sins” means, or is supposed to. Christians don’t do animal sacrifices because of that. But then they invented a whole bunch of crap about confession, which is completely irrelevant and only for people who don’t even want to attempt self-control.
My second comment, yes opinion, but BS? Yes in the sense that you don’t need to know it.
@iambrian, I think it’s not so much the dying as it was his suffering. He supposedly suffered/died to earn God’s forgiveness on behalf of all those who follow him and accept him as their savior.
I think It’s all based on the inherent belief that we’re all born into sin/going to hell (as in “original sin”…Adam & Eve bullshit) and the only way to absolve yourself of this sin is to accept Christ as your lord & savior, worshipping him as the son of God, and following his teachings…or some shit like that.
I DON’T KNOW. I’m not a Christian or Catholic of any form. This is what my understanding of it is based on what religious people have told me. I’m likely just talking out my ass.
Wasn’t the devil like bff’s with Jesus at one point and then he was banished? Well what if during that time they were like, okay lets make these people feel like they sin against the greater good and threaten them of the eternal damned or utopia and see how they each take this information in their human lives with such opportunities to indulge in sins and being a good person.
I don’t know my religious stance, I feel spiritual though. But dying for our sins kind of sounds like we are the victims of some huge sin that we have already made when we are born?
Another thing, Jesus was Jewish right, so why do people like feel negative about Jewish people, and why are they Christian not Jewish?
This is where each one of you is wrong. Jesus did not die on the cross. He was saved and went on to live for a long time to the age of 120 and then Died a natural death in Kashmir.
@manimal, Haha calm down buddy, I don’t believe in any religion either. I was simply pointing out that they do have value even if you don’t think so. I assure you I’m not a bigot feeding my ego bullshit. Have you never heard of self improvement? Being a good person? Treating others the way you want to be treated? I’m sure that’s all bullshit though and was created to “make people submit.” Every single religion in the world preaches about treating other people with love and respect, while also loving and respecting yourself. I don’t know how that is possibly a bad thing. Sure, there are bad things in religion. Much like there are bad things on the internet, but instead of saying the entire internet is bullshit, we simply find the good sites and use those. Much in the same way, we take away the good things from christianity, buddhism, islam, whatever it is and utilize them.
@iambrian, It’s all bullshit in my opinion, so don’t even worry about it! :) By the way, I grew up Catholic and spent Kindergarten through Senior year of High School studying the good ol’ dude Jesus, so I’m not just some dude.
Also, sins would require the idea of right and wrong. Your right can be my wrong and vise versa.
@blankey, Sin is not right or wrong, it is the misuse of our concepts, unavoidable in a being that is not all knowing. If you have no connotation to it, it still cannot be denied that certain things are beneficial, as they make things easier or pain is avoided, this is the best use of concepts and no matter what we do we can never completely avoid accidental counter-productivity.
So it comes down to intent, if you intend harm or not. This does not mean that if you did not intend you are not accountable, but rather the opposite, people who make mistakes unintentionally, these people always take responsibility, it is the people who do intend harm that deny it was their fault.
@manimal, Becoming a better person than others? Not possible, you can’t be a better me anymore than I can be a better you. But yes, that idea fuels judgementality, people should introspect and find their own psychological balance but also figure out the most appropriate ways to behave toward one another. The failure in this by others means you protect yourself from them, an appropriate response.
However, religions being systems of control, yes self-control, and a lot of them are wrong about the distinction between tolerance and apathy, just as they are not clear on the distinction between offering help with guidance versus judgementality.
The thing is that a lot of the mass controls religions engage in are actually the result of a Theocratic institution, these that define or redefine meanings in terminology to steer behaviour in a direction that suits them and this defies the intended balance and appropriateness the religion was designed for.
The thing is that some religions encourage freethinking and building the confidence in people to trust their own judgement, rather than demanding conformity to a blueprint of what is acceptable or not. Generalizing religions as mass control mechanisms is not accurate to negatively connote it when self control is an ideal when combined with strength in freedom of choice.
I feel like Jesus was just a great guy who possibly was ‘awakened’, and just wanted people to love, and basically laid down some basic concepts so the average Joe could live a life of love. But of course human nature is to twist and exaggerate things. So now people worship and and believe in pearly gates or eternal fire afterlife and a whole bunch of other stuff that most likely isn’t true IMO. I should probably read the bible and do some more research before I draw conclusions about the worlds most popular belief though…