It seems that it is considered morally wrong to not support our troops. Americans are expected to unquestioningly respect and admire the troops for their service. What purpose are our soldiers serving these days ? It seems obvious to me that the U.S. is not in Iraq or Afghanistan to fight evil Nazis or protect innocent people. In fact many of those people hate the soldiers and don’t want them there. .However, year after year thousands of people are killed and billions of dollars are lost . This is why I don’t and many other people don’t support the war. Therefore it would seem logical that you can’t support the troops if you don’t support the war , right?
@manimal, “And at any given moment, they have the option to desert and terminate the deal. Sure it’s illegal and frowned upon and might lead to penalties, but it’s still a perfectly good option nonetheless if one looks beyond the excuses.”
Article 85 of the UCMJ: Desertion. Punishable by the brig, and it times of war, death. Death is not an excuse or an inconvenient penalty. Its the ultimate penalty.
I’m gonna be totally honest here, the way you’re talking, it sounds to me like you’re blowing smoke out your ass when you say you served. I mean, there’d at least be some understanding on your part here if you knew what it was like to live this lifestyle.
I would like to start off with saying I have read through all of these post and I thank you for all you interest and glad to see people voicing there opinions.
“Can I ask where you get this ‘fact’? Is it from experience? Or is that what the media tells you?”
Yes most of what I and everyone knows is from some type of media , television , newspaper, magazines, internet websites, video, film , radio are all forms of media. I agree you cannot get your source of information from just one. However if I gather many together I believe I can form an educated opinion. My opinion is this most of the civilians are not happy about the U.S. presence and the constant battles fought in their backyard as a consequence. Truthfully I have not been over there so I cannot back up what I read with firsthand experience. So let me ask this question to the soldiers, particularly ones that have served in the Middle East recently. What do the people think of the U.S. and its’ military presence in their country?
”Meaning because the US military is present there as a dominant humanitarian (Yes Bitches I said Humanitarian) and peacekeeping force those countries haven’t seen the need to fight eachother.”
That does put me a bit a ease. I thank you for your insight. However, it seems that we pick and choose who we want to help. In Bahrain, during 2011 there was an uprising for “ achieving greater political freedom and equality for the majority Shia population and expanded to a call to end the monarchy of King Hamad. Hamad.” Reaction from the regime was to kill and beat many of the protestors and doctors who tried to support them . However the united states military did nothing to help protect these people trying to fight for their freedom because; “Bahrain hosts the United States Naval Support Activity Bahrain, the home of the US Fifth Fleet; the US Department of Defense considers the location critical to its attempts to counter Iranian military power in the region.” So are we really there in other countries for altruistic means?
I would also like to say you don’t need to join the military to do humanitarian work. Furthermore you don’t need to join the military to receive a paycheck. You can join the peace core that will pay off part of your student loans and pay for your rent and food while overseas.
“They chose to join, that means they agreed to the terms, which included being given orders without the rights to resist.”
I like this point. I think that it clarifies well why I didn’t join . I took the ASVAB and was talking to recruiters back in 2007. However, I realized I didn’t want to put myself in a situation where I would have to kill and bomb people or support and enable anyone else to do so. Soldiers should not hide behind the idea of just following orders. It is clear what the military offers and what the consequences are. Therefore you receive a steady pay check as compensation. I don’t believe I should support you or believe that you are just doing your duty to protect our country. I do believe that you talents are being wasted and we could use your bravery and determination in the civilian world to help some of the problems at home.
No. Not really. Yep. Nope. Not really. Nopetinope.
How would having a bank account turn someone into a puppet? It’s nice to have a place to put my money, and getting interest is nice too. I’m gaining from it, and it’s not like the situation is out of my control.
Now THIS is laughable. Your assumptions are not correct. I do not live under anyone’s system, sure I am part of some systems but there is nothing controlling me there, and I could easily leave at any given time. Using the internet, puppetish? How? I am simply using an electronic device to communicate, there is nobody controlling me there. And I’m not exactly known for following rules, which you probably remember.
Sure, I was a major puppet, I wouldn’t deny that. But that was in the past, I have no strings to pull. I think that’s the biggest advantage of this lifestyle.
What if you lost your job and the situation became out of your control. They can screw your credit, and claim anything you own that’s worth money if it came down to it. They convince you about what your making off them, but they’re making more off you than you make off them.
If you want to close out your account they can tell you that you owe them money for closing your account. If you ignore them they can put you in collections. They can screw you over for a minimum of 8 years and they still have you convinced that your the one in control.
Yes, it is an excuse. And I don’t know about you, but I think death would be a very inconvenient penalty. I get your point, but as I said, if you sacrifice freedom for safety you deserve no freedom. And no safety either. If you aren’t willing to face the risk of dying for what you want, you don’t deserve to have it. That’s why the people who take great risks achieve the most.
I did serve, but how has that got anything to do with agreeing with irresponsible who play the blame game? I knew what I signed up for, signing up for something without understanding the terms is idiocy. I knew I would be pushed and pulled without mercy, and I knew I would have to face a bunch of fuckers who wanted to shoot me, and I knew that maybe I’d have to kill. It was part of the deal, I chose to sign up so there was no sense in complaining. Neither did my comrades complain, they took responsibility for their choices. We all knew what we signed up for, we all knew what roles we would have to play. We learned to like it.
I’m not the one that doesn’t understand, you are. A person who signs up for something he doesn’t want is a jackass, the rest is just a bunch of excuses.
Now I ask you, have YOU served?
I don’t have a job. Remember in my last post when I answered “no” to your question “do you have a job?” Priceless.
Nor will the situation go out of my control, since I pay attention to what I’m doing. But let’s say it did, it wouldn’t bother me one bit. So what if I lost a bunch of shit? It’s just a bunch of stuff, some of which is more or less just abstract concepts, there’s plenty of stuff in this world. But let’s say I did care about this stuff, and they wanted to take it, I could prevent it through methods such as hiding or misleading. They make money off of the accumulation of many people’s savings, not a single person, and ironically people with more savings get more returns. And if they were making a bit more off the deal than I, that would be worth it for the service and I would know.
But it’s all off topic. This is about soldiers, not money. If you want to discuss money we can do so elsewhere.
@ortezjp Now this is good. Indeed, signing up for something you don’t want is crazy, and they’re definitely wasting their talent on fighting when they could instead help build and improve.
@comicsanmc Then you must have misread the part about my definition. It’s nowhere in there, you made it up. That’s just pathetic, if you can’t discuss things without making shit up you shouldn’t discuss at all. And if it was an honest misunderstanding, then pay more attention when reading/listening or don’t discuss.
One who has no strings to pull cannot be a puppet, and I lost my strings quite a long time ago. That’s why I spread this way of being, so people won’t be puppets “against their will.”
Ah true enough there isn’t any direct line of text that brought me to that conclusion. I suppose it was more a definition that resulted from the ongoing conversation as to what we define a puppet as. The closest I came to it is below.
“You gave your time and attention (money) to someone else’s cause (making money off your money), just because they offered money and some other stuff (Interest on your money). You got your strings pulled, mate (homie). That makes you a puppet (Pinocchio).”
Well, it’s quite simple.
If you’ve got a soft boiled egg and want to make the most of that liquidy yolk you can’t just cut the toast like you normally would – the standard halving technique. Horizontal or diagonal; it doesn’t matter – It simply will not fit in the egg properly! You’ll sit there for hours and the yolk will re-solidify not too long after it is exposed to the air. Not to mention the fact that it will go cold making your breakfast/lunch (not dinner/tea – freak!) nowhere near as enjoyable as it could have been.
Or is it?
The ‘soldier’ technique is the slicing of toast into considerably thinner strips allowing for easy access to the eggy deliciousness. It’s really quite simple.
An image to give you an idea:
Here’s an “action shot” – from a real news source (Telegraph) so you know I’m not making it up. There is a learning curve, as it can be a small target. Maybe start with an Ostrich egg until you can be sure of hitting the target:
So there! The purpose of a soldier!
Glad we cleared that up!
@manimal, What I want most is the freedom to live my life while not in jail.
I knew exactly what I signed up for. I knew how much control they would have over me. I’m not complaining about what I do. I wish we werent here, I wish we were doing something else more beneficial to the world, but that’s not my call.
I signed up because I wanted to work hard and not deal with bullshit. I got the opposite of that with the military. I knew I’d be doing what I’m doing. When I signed up, I agreed with it. I couldnt wait to put some warheads on foreheads. But I have changed, and I see that we get no gain out of where we are, and I dont agree with it anymore.
Yes. I’m in Kuwait as we speak. In a comfy bed in a hardened barracks with free wifi. I havent had the pleasure of actually being in a combat zone or getting shot at.