Shooting Again! 27 Dead! Again? Is this becoming a weekly event?

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0 votes, posted 12.14.2012 at 12:08 pm
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Kidd (@kidd)1 year, 7 months ago ago

Education needs to be improved. Most social and world problems have roots in ignorance.

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stryder (@stryder)1 year, 7 months ago ago

The guy who did this shooting was obviously a maniac of some description. No amount of “education” would change what he did.

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stryder (@stryder)1 year, 7 months ago ago

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Nikki (@vespertine)1 year, 7 months ago ago

Do people seriously think gun control will change NOTHING? Of course it doesn’t help the core of the problem, but right now EVERYONE can in the US can easily do what this guy has done if they were crazy enough to do it. You have a gun, therefore, you could decide to shoot someone (or several people).
The argument “The people are really the problem, not guns, therefore gun control will make no difference” really makes no sense. Should a problem either be completely eliminated, or stay the same? Why so black and white? Every bit that helps, is worth it.

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Anonymous (@)1 year, 7 months ago ago

“No amount of “education” would change what he did.”

This is true. But then, people only learn by example, so on the off chance that he didn’t blow his brains out after his day out, the only way to actually help him and other people like him is by demonstrating a bit of humanity. Calling him a maniac is like jerking an anti social nut bar off.

Heal the nut bars of tomorrow, forgive the nutbars of yesteryear!

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Avatar of Tony
Tony (@antlob)1 year, 7 months ago ago

Gun control wouldn’t solve this at all, as many people have stated.

Crazies will kill people with kitchen knives if they have to.

Societal MENTAL HEALTH – that’s the key to lessening these.

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Anonymous (@)1 year, 7 months ago ago

Those who own guns legally are not the problem. Those who own guns illegally are the problem.

Any gun-control laws that are enacted will take away the responsible person’s right to protection. The criminals (who don’t abide by laws anyways [hence why they are criminals]) will continue to obtain their weaponry how they always have: under-the-counter and under-the-radar.

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Anonymous (@)1 year, 7 months ago ago

“Do people seriously think gun control will change NOTHING? Of course it doesn’t help the core of the problem, but right now EVERYONE can in the US can easily do what this guy has done if they were crazy enough to do it. You have a gun, therefore, you could decide to shoot someone (or several people).”

I realise that shooting a kid is dramatic, but what if someone decided it was too much hassle to get hold of guns and just poisoned their cafeteria with strychnine instead? Limiting a persons options only encourages creativity.

Maybe it’s a macho thing though. Feeling bad ass, like dirty harry, chasing a toddler round the playground. People’s heads, eh?

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Starski (@starski)1 year, 7 months ago ago

In short:

Reactive solution: Gun control
Proactive solution: Be better people overall. If the universe gave him love instead of hate, he may have never needed a gun. ( seems silly, idealist, and improbable, but what happens if this works JUST ONE?)

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Anonymous (@)1 year, 7 months ago ago

Treating this problem with gun control laws is like going to the doctors office, and is reductionist logic;

A severe underlying problem is treated only by covering the symptoms (gun control), rather than the root of the problem (mental health issues).

Sure gun control would help, but it won’t cure the sickness.

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ELizard (@heavydreamz)1 year, 7 months ago ago

We live in a separated society where guns are used against eachother when we were given the right only to protect one another. Where to begin with the sadness in this world with its roots in fear, fear that drives us apart, protecting ourselves from eachother. Sad world. Something is not right. I don’t think guns are to blame, we are people in this life together, we don’t do this to eachother. Something is not right.

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Living Stone (@cloudstuck)1 year, 7 months ago ago

I can’t believe the amount of you saying that gun control won’t help. You’re blind to the fact that all these guns out there, especially the ones that you use to “protect” yourselves, is ingraining in your society an idea of conflict from the very beginning. “Guns, guns, guns, we need more guns because of all the maniacs out there.” You’re shooting yourselves in the foot (pardon the pun) in creating a society that doesn’t trust anyone. I know from behaviour like this it does help the argument of not trusting anyone, but having guns available like this also promotes a very reactive action, ie. going out and shooting all these kids. Have them significantly harder to get and it gives the person more time to be cured, more time to re-think things, and most importantly, more time for these kids to grow up. I’m not saying it will definitely stop people like this guy, but it will help.

You guys are lying to yourselves if you think gun control won’t help, or it will push the problem elsewhere. Gun control is like putting a band aid on the wound whilst it heals. Fast action, whilst we heal society with love.

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DaJetPlane (@lytning91)1 year, 7 months ago ago

Gun control won’t stop anything. As I said previously in the thread, if a maniac wants to kill a large group of vulnerable people, anything can become a weapon. @mimic mentioned it when talking about poison in the food. It’s not like it’d hard to make a bomb or create poison out a lot of things…gasoline is distributed EVERYWHERE.

It is a comfortable lie to think you can stop these types of things by removing an object…it is a false hope and an ignorance to the fact that the killer is in the person, not the device.

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Kidd (@kidd)1 year, 7 months ago ago

@stryder, Actually, education would help. He might have known where and how to get help before all this. Even if it didn’t help him specifically, people would know what signs to look for in a mentally ill or unstable person. They’d know what to do about it. This applies especially to the people closest to him.

Ignorance is at the root of most every problem, I promise. Education, inside and outside of the school system, needs to be improved.

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Avatar of ELizard
ELizard (@heavydreamz)1 year, 7 months ago ago

@cloudstuck, we have the right to bear arms to protect ourselves from an oppressive government, not to protect ourselves from each other. Somewhere along the way that was switched and now backwards along side everything else.

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Avatar of Living Stone
Living Stone (@cloudstuck)1 year, 7 months ago ago

@heavydreamz, So you’re all waiting for an uprising against the government. Okay. Whatever reason you find the extreme availability of guns okay, then fine, use that reason. I, personally am sure that guns instinctively create a mindset of fear and/or power in the beholder. And personally, I don’t think either one of those mindsets are good. I do believe in a free society and availability of all things (drugs, information, etc.) but society isn’t ready for that. And this is shows us why. Put a band aid on your society for gods sake.

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Avatar of Matt
Matt (@greenthinker)1 year, 7 months ago ago

@cloudstuck, @stryder, @vespertine,

Please familiarize yourselves with switzerland’s gun policy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Switzerland#Gun_crime

Everyone in switzerland has a gun. EVERYONE. How many gun related deaths in 2006? 34.
Not only do the swiss have guns, they all have fully automatic weapons.

Now I know America is not Switzerland. However, guns are guns no matter where they are located, and if you are going to make an argument that guns change the mindset of someone, you are wrong because they are only a tool.

I think everyone should be trained and armed, notice I said “trained” first, thus preventing you from shooting yourself in the foot.

I also do not believe that arming everyone will fully solve our problem of sociopaths. America has many people per capita, therefore we have far more of these incidents than other countries. All that means is that people need to take to time to be involved in their families. I am a lucky one, I have many people to talk to and get help from if I were to ever need it. This is not the case for a large portion of this country.

I don’t know this kid’s story, but I care, and that is something which is being lost in these news reportings. I feel absolutely horrible for the families of the deceased, but I also feel bad for the killer because this kid obviously had no one to help him.

Make the harder choice when you hear of these stories, and choose to help the people. If you want to fix this country, start emphasizing family values, and community values.

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Avatar of Nikki
Nikki (@vespertine)1 year, 7 months ago ago

I am sorry but I can’t really see the reasoning. If you can supposedly kill anyone in anyway if you wanted to just as easily with guns, than why have guns anyway? Can’t you just poison/set on fire/stab whoever you want to protect yourself from? Which would be easier?

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Avatar of Jeremy
Jeremy (@chadvice)1 year, 7 months ago ago

@lytning91, @ijesuschrist, @cloudstuck,
Straight from the Tao Te Ching:

When a country is in harmony with the Tao,
the factories make trucks and tractors.
When a country goes counter to the Tao,
warheads are stockpiled outside the cities. There is no greater illusion than fear, no greater wrong than preparing to defend yourself,
no greater misfortune than having an enemy. Whoever can see through all fear will always be safe.

This kind of evil will always exist. Fighting it is not the answer. Understanding it is the path to the answer. But as for the answer itself? I don’t know…

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Avatar of Kris
Kris (@kjbaran)1 year, 7 months ago ago

If I were to take a random guess, I’d say that old Uncle Sam is up to no good again. What’s the best way to get a nation to put down their arms? Make them think that their guns are bad, then they’ll want to institute news laws that take the guns away. Defenseless nation. Kinda like reverse psychology.

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Avatar of nataku
nataku (@nataku)1 year, 7 months ago ago

So?

Solution 1: more gun control

Solution 2: Nurture (compassion, education and mental help)

Solution 3: wild wild west (Everyone has guns ALL THE TIME to protect themselves from the next psycho )

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Avatar of Givan
Givan (@liammcfeely)1 year, 7 months ago ago

I think the only way for us to really fight this is by moving on. By showing that this even didn’t leave a lasting impact on society, which was most likely the goal of the shooter, it may discourage others from trying things like this

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Avatar of Dino
Dino (@nosorozh)1 year, 7 months ago ago

@liammcfeely, id say that this incident happened for this exact reason. The society paid no attention to his problems, so he went to the extreme to be noticed ( in his own , not so acceptable a way) . get out there and nurture the crap out of that society!

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Anonymous (@)1 year, 7 months ago ago

wow can there be an event that DOESN’T have to entail an large-governmental conspiracy behind it. Jesus christ! (Yes?)

Gun control would maybe limit access to guns, which would make it harder for stuff like this to happen, sure. I give you this.

But Like lytning said, anyone can make a bomb from gasoline – our nation is fueled by explosives, literally. Its not like you take away guns and those that find themselves mentally sick just start twiddling there thumbs.

I don’t think the main objective should be to take guns away, it shouldn’t even be an issue that people want guns in the first place. (Like the Tao Chi Chung reference is getting at).

But in the meanwhile, we need to address social anxiety, child-hood depression, mental health, and parenting of children. But how? How do we do that on a grand scale? We can’t and we won’t because it is intrusive. We can only lead a horse to water, we cannot make them drink.

So there isn’t an answer. This stuff will probably continue to happen for many more years. The best you can do is be a good person, smile at people, respect everyone, and teach your friends, your offspring, and your family to do the same.

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Avatar of Living Stone
Living Stone (@cloudstuck)1 year, 7 months ago ago

@chadvice, Thank you for posting that.

Understanding our fear is the path to overcoming it. I don’t think society in general understand their fear, which to me is the idea that they think it is them against the world. And that means to bear arms because you don’t know what will attack you next. I’m sure 90% of the people who have mentioned that they need weapons to defend themselves have never actually been attacked in their lives (I apologise if I have offended anyone by that assumption, but you can see why that is a realistic assumption).

People need to start viewing the world through their own eyes and see how beautiful and lovely this world is, rather than through the news’ eyes which shows how evil it can be. That is not the truth. That is warped reality.

Living in fear is a waste of a life. Live it, take chances, don’t worry, be free, say what you want to say. Don’t live a life worrying what would happen if you did that, worried about who might attack you, worried about who might attack your children…no one has. Live, live, live. Guns help cushion a mindset of fear and power…they are not helpful mindsets no matter what anyone says.

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