Suicidal thoughts, letting go, and healing for real (long)
|Heed them, HEthen|
Hello HEthens, I’m bringing both a universally and personally very sensitive topic to you today…
It’s hard for me to say it out loud or type it, but I’m getting better about it. Not talking about it just lets it simmer and become a dangerous, silent animal.
I took the first step of explaining my suicidal thoughts to my boyfriend of 1.5yrs during a bad fight (very very rare) where I was refusing to explain to him why I had been a crying wreck for two days straight.
I thought I had conquered those thoughts…. I have a lifelong history of battling depression, extreme insecurity, overcompensating and so on.
I hadn’t had serious suicidal thoughts in a long time… Like every once in a while, but it was always a sort of “passing option” on a purely logical, detached standpoint. I believe in reincarnation and all that, so the very thought of not living is scary but not that scary.
I had had what I thought was a “personal revolution” the beginning of this year. I had had immense spiritual re-awakenings during this time, completely overhauled my diet, lost weight successfully for the first time ever, started working out and found how much I loved it… so many good things happened.
But this has all seemed to shrink to minute nothings almost, and I feel no inspiration in daily life and am having a hard time reinstating my always unwavering faith in the universe.
Best days I feel numb and unaffected, most days I smoke weed and distract myself from what happens when I remember what I’m feeling. Just sadness sadness sadness.
I feel like I have lost all my friends. Actually, I feel like I never had any friends to begin with, honestly. I overanalyze everything, and it seems like I overestimate my worth to people every single time.
I want to let go. I want to let go of how people affect my life so. badly. I know this is what I need to do in order to get out of this funk. Otherwise I’m going to spiral too quickly and that’s such a dangerous place for me to be. Nothing but deep self-loathing with gross self-pity.
And I KNOW when I’m “all there” mentally and not just some passing-by haze of mind, that I care so much less about what people think.
But I can’t seem to let things go. I’ve been reading up on “purging negativity” and all that.
I know about meditation, I know all the tricks. I just want to feel better. :( I want to stop being so sad and without inspiration or energy to do things. I want to feel the magic of life again, but as a normal person on the path to enlightenment, not the internal hype of successfully making a few lifestyle changes while manic like before. It’s a deluded way of thinking and I’ve noticed this.
I guess all I want to know is if there’s any success stories out there… I just need some sort of human interaction on this issue.
Any comments or additions is welcome, just don’t throw me any of the “suicide is selfish” crap. Literally only feeds the fire. I understand the very nature of the thoughts of suicide very well.
I’m really, really sorry it’s so longwinded. This is literally only the third time I’ve ever tackled this issue both in print and out loud, so I have a lot of pent up feelings..
For a start, I would suggest you stop smoking weed completely. It can be a very enlightening drug but it tends to have the opposite effect on people who suffer from a range of things such as bipolar and anxiety.
Start going for long walks or light jogs. Download podcasts on topics you find interesting or funny and just go on long foot trips and absorb the information as well as your surroundings (depending on what I feel like I might listen to NFL podcasts about the weeks match ups, or I might crank some Joe Rogan and see what interesting character he has on to discuss life that week).
Get some sun every day that it’s out. Even if it means sitting on a bench somewhere for 15-20 minutes a day.
Try and keep your facebook deactivated. Now’s a chance to go and build friendships you actually want out there in the real world (or even if you’re not looking to make new friends, if you don’t like the people who you had online then there’s no reason to go back and put yourself through the stress of wondering what people might be saying about you or how they react to things you publish).
Don’t sleep for really long hours. Get 7-8 hours then get up and stay up. Don’t move from the bed to the couch.
And I’m not sure if you do or not, but don’t listen to depressing music. This one is hard and some might argue that it’s stupid. Sad songs can be a great source of healing for more temporary issues such as break ups, fall outs, career choices, life midpoints etc but they do nothing to get you out of a funk for which you have not pinpointed the specific reason (or means to overcome it).
Do little things, whether they be placebos or not. Drink lots of water. Smile.
And most importantly, keep your chin up. You’re beautiful :)
I think it’s awesome your brave enough to make a post about it :) Your situation sounds very similar to mine.
I agree with Alex, you should stop smoking weed because I find that it really does amplify negative emotions. I do find it very useful for meditation but I no longer enjoy smoking with friends.
Perhaps this video will help you :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxRQVBDtB_8 It’s made me feel better.
Hi @heedthem, I just happened onto your post today. I’d like to offer you some thoughts:
1. One of the most important things I do to keep myself out of a depressive state is to go somewhere and/or be with people. Isolation is the default position for someone with depression, and must be avoided. I find that when I go outside, drive somewhere, or walk somewhere, it always changes my state.
2. Another thing, easier said than done, is to get someone almost like a sponsor in AA, who is a resource for you, who will reach out to you, who is available as needed to encourage you to “get outside of your internal world.”
3. Something that made a huge difference in my life was to attend a Tony Robbins event called Unleash the Power Within. He has a lot of great stuff that really allowed me to shift some of my beliefs.
4. Find something outside of yourself to care about and invest in. Volunteering somewhere where the people (or animals, if that’s your thing) are clearly less well off than you. Even when I feel at my lowest, I intellectually understand that I am really blessed with a LOT. Spending time with homeless people, orphans, abandoned animals, mentally handicapped people, other groups who are marginalized for one reason or another.
I haven’t been on this message board before so I’m not sure if I will receive en mail notification of any responses to this message, so I’ll check back here in case there is a response.
Best wishes. I’m sending you positive thoughts!
@heedthem, First thing’s first; cut the weed. Seriously, no more. And this is coming from a guy who got blitzed out of his mind every day for 2 years straight. My family has a history of anxiety issues so in retrospect I should of seen it coming but after a while weed was no longer my friend. It was a way for me to numb myself down, sure, but it was also contributing to my depressive downward spiral. I have OCD, so it’s very easy for me to get stuck in a thought loop for hours without even noticing it.
As for the self-loathing thoughts, I think we can agree that we generally don’t want them, correct? As in, if we could get the thoughts to stop, to stop from coming into our psyche, we would we better off. This is delusional thinking. Studies have shown that it is impossible for us to control what enters our mind, it’s like the brain is a thought processing machine that never stops. So basically, when it comes to the thoughts that enter our minds, we basically have to bend over and take it whether we like it or not.
There is hope though; you don’t necessarily have to believe what your brain throws your way. You say you know all the tricks to meditation so I’m assuming you know how to observe your thoughts. The trick is to just sit back and see what the brain throws at you and then just call it out on its shit. Any time a ”man life sucks, I’ll never be anybody, no one likes me, I wish it would all just end, God please diagnose me with cancer so that I die without my parents having to go through the trauma of losing a child to suicide…etc.” thought would enter my mind I could a) believe it at face value or b) call my mind out on its bullshit. After a while of calling it out on its shit you kind of start….mocking your brain. I’ll be studying or some shit and then one of the old horrible thoughts creeps in and I just laugh, let it go, and move on.
As for wanting to feel to spark of life again, go out there and find ways to feel alive. And it doesn’t necessarily have to be drugs or sex or alcohol. When I was really down in the slumps I would go out and run until my heart couldn’t take it anymore just to feel what it was like to push the body to its limits. We spend an entire lifetime in this body and yet most of us never push it to its limits. That was the best thing I did that helped alleviate the depression.
Sorry for the long post bud, topics like these can’t be tl;dr’d in my opinion. Best tip I can give you is to keep your head up (cliché I know, but it’s fucking true). Depression is not something you cure over night, it takes much longer than that. Think about how long it took you to fall into this slump; it will most likely take just as long to get out of it. But you can do it, many have, just look up success stories on Google. I’d give you a hug if I could :D
|Heed them, HEthen|
I do already have a history of working out that I’ve taken up. Although I’ve been neglecting it more recently, and it does help me situationally, it never gets rid of the sadness. :[
You got me pretty good on the other ones, though, besides depressing music. I’m really good at wanting what kind of music I need at the time. (I don’t really listen to depressing music to begin with though. Only the old alt rock/hard rock from my childhood is sad, and I only listen to it cause I like knowing all the words and it makes me nostalgic.)
Thank you for your additions
|Heed them, HEthen|
@orange, Thank you for kind words, I’ve been fed negative responses to this kind of seeking out before (without me admitting the suicide part, just extreme depression) and it totally sucks.
That video, though… just damn. I literally only listened to the first minute, but I already like what he was saying. After I’m done responding I’m going to go finish it.
I know people are saying cut the weed completely, but I’ve struggle with depression and suicidal urges too and I can tell you with utmost honesty that without weed I would assuredly be dead right now. If you’re really sitting there with a razor blade in your left hand and a blunt in your right hand. Choose the fucking blunt. I know that sometimes it is like that. I’ve been there. It’s not like that all the time though, so SAVE YOUR WEED for the darkest nights when you’re at your lowest. That’s my advice.
Also, you have to realize smoking socially is a lot different than smoking alone. When you smoke by yourself, people tend to spend a lot of time inside their own head, which can be a very dangerous place to be if you stay there too long. Depressed people know what I’m talking about.
What is your schedule like? Is it regular? DO you sleep during the same hours every night? If not, you need to start right away. Use the timers or datebooks on your phone to create an eating and sleeping schedule and stick to it. Schedule/Routine will become your savior. It’s like a floaty that will keep you from drowning.
Also, you didn’t mention what thoughts and feelings fuel your depression. If it’s guilt or shame, do things that you will be proud of at the end of the day. Every time you make a good decision, write it down in a pocket notebook. Example: “At 11:00am I resisted the urge to stop at mcdonald’s and I stuck to my healthy diet.” At the end of the day, you’ll have maybe 20 things like that written on your page. Sit down as you would sit down to meditate. Spend 20 minutes just being thankful to yourself and proud of yourself for each and every good decision you made and every goal you accomplished that day.
People practice saying “thank you” to others because they don’t expect other people to care about them. People don’t say thank you to themselves because it’s usually a given that you appreciate yourself. So, what happens when that’s not a given anymore? You have to start saying “thank you” to yourself, Consciously deeming yourself worthy of gratitude because your subconscious isn’t doing that anymore. Once you get in the habit of consciously being grateful for yourself and the good things that you do, it will begin to happen subconsciously again.
Also, get up early enough to see the sun rise. You don’t have to watch it, but it’s natural for you body and mind. Make making plans a habit. People who are gonna kill themselves don’t make plans. As long as you can keep yourself making plans, you don’t have to worry about committing suicide.
|Heed them, HEthen|
1.) You’re totallyyy right on the isolation thing, and I’m already a hermit to begin with. I think my isolationism I’ve been experiencing is not positive, but I think that it has been a necessary recoil with the people I have available in my life. I crave positive human interaction, it hurts me that I’m without it and I feel like I’m dying inside sometimes because of this realization that the friends that I have had, that are still present in my life that I have removed myself from, have never thought much of me and are negative people. However, I am left with literally no one to interact with.
2.) I looked for things like “suicide support groups” in my area, I actually really really wanted to involve myself with others like me somehow, but I have had zero luck after a few hours of searching. The only thing I could find is “suicide survivors”, but feel like I would be look down on since I’m only a prospector and have never tried to commit in actuality.
3.) That actually made me think of “The Power of Now” by Eckhart Tolle right away, and I have downloaded the audiobook. I will also google some self-help/happiness seminars that might come by.
4.) I care a whole lot about art (Illust. major) and have estranged myself from it since my last art class like a year and a half ago… Inspiration and lack of motivation was a nasty roadblock for a long time and since then have been reinspired with images in my head… and I WANT to draw every single day, but.. I always feel so defeated and unable to. Like I like what it’s my head. I want to draw it down. I put my hand to the paper… …. … I can’t do it. It’s the same way with anything to matters to me. I suddenly have some inability. It’s like my neurotransmitters aren’t working and I’m unable to put the lines onto the paper.
But for volunteering…. I like puppies and kittens, they almost always make me smile. I’ve considered volunteering at the shelter before, I might put that to the test now.
Thank you for your advice and sweetness.
Definitely volunteer. Someplace where you work with people who don’t know you. Getting to know new people will probably energize you.
Another technique, if quitting weed is too difficult for you, is to make “weed rules” for yourself. Example: I will only smoke while I’m doing illustration. That way maybe you’ll have more inspiration for your art.
Or whatever rules you think might really bring you closer to your goals. Just make sure you are using the weed and not abusing it.
|Heed them, HEthen|
A better solution is probably to make it a special-occasion, “reward” type thing. A tool to properly relax when it is time to relax.
You’re right on all the thought bullshit… It’s just so difficult to not get swayed by the mind momentum of things. Emotions will just wash over me like a tidal wave and knock me down, completely out of left field. And once that happens, I’m pretty done for. It’s hard to pick myself up when I’m plunged into a pit of despair without being prepared.
I’ve already tackled the avenue of working out as an outlet… Although it is a good tool, it really is only useful when I already have the energy to run or something to that point. I WANT to go out and run and enjoy, I LOVE working out. But I’m faced with this “feeling” of innate inability, I just have no strength or endurance when I’m depressed and am constantly tired.
I have only good feelings for someone who posts long responses. It means you’re either as longwinded as I am or put thought into your answer, or both.
And thank you :’( Sometimes that’s all I want; a nice, platonic, human-caring-about-another-human hug. Thinking about anyone even having that simple thought about me at all almost made me burst into tears reading it. Just a cesspool of intense emotions grounded on deep sorrow.
This is a excerpt from ZEN & THE ART OF HAPPINESS that really convinced and motivated me to change my depressed thoughts.
[...]when a new cell is produced, it isn’t always a clone of the old cell but a cell that contains more receptors for whatever peptide it received that caused it to split. If the cell received peptides produced by emotions of depression, the new cell will have more receptors for depression and fewer receptors to receive feel-good peptides. You rely on cell division for the reproduction, growth, repair, and replacement of damaged, worn-out, or dead cells. An estimated 300 million cell divisions occur every minute to replace cells that die. Each day, two percent of your blood cells die and are replaced by fresh ones. Every two months, you have an entirely new blood supply. Given what we now know about peptides, receptors, and the role of emotions and thoughts, you can see the chain of events that takes place as new cells are created according to what you think and feel. If you feel depressed for an hour, you’ve produced approximately eighteen billion new cells that have more receptors calling out for depressed-type peptides and fewer calling out for feel-good peptides. It’s as if trillions and trillions of receptors are all cupping their little hands around their mouths like tiny megaphones and shouting, “Send us more depression!” In short, thinking gloomy thoughts creates a body that is more able to feel gloominess than joyfulness. It also creates the need for more gloomy thoughts, and you become addicted to gloominess.
Prentiss, Chris (2011-10-01). Zen and the Art of Happiness (Kindle Locations 408-419). SCB Distributors. Kindle Edition.
@heedthem, Well, recognizing whether you’re using it to just relax or because you want to not face your problems is fairly simple in my opinion. If you reach for the bong because you’re feeling down and you hope weed is going to help you, that’s not a good thing to do. If you’re drawing some illustrations and you just want it because you’re in a good mind set, then that would be okay.
”You’re right on all the thought bullshit… It’s just so difficult to not get swayed by the mind momentum of things. Emotions will just wash over me like a tidal wave and knock me down, completely out of left field. And once that happens, I’m pretty done for. It’s hard to pick myself up when I’m plunged into a pit of despair without being prepared.”
The key here is to see it coming. I know it can come up at the worst times (my depressive/suicidal idealization would always come up when I was playing hockey, fav sport, and that got me really down at the start) but if you see it coming it gets much easier. I like your tidal wave analogy, what I would suggest would be to see the wave and then think ”fuck yeah time to go surfing”. You KNOW your mind is about to do some funky shit, you KNOW it’s about to try and knock you down so prepare for it. All the horrid thoughts you’ve had before are about to come back and hit just as hard as they did before, but this time is difference is this time you’ll be ready for it. Just ride it out, this too shall pass.
The effects of doing this are subtle at first but after a while they snowball and you gain a huge momentum. My worst thought loop was/is: ”What’s the meaning of life?” which leads to ”Well, the current scientific paradigm kinda says that everything is the result of random occurences” which leads to ”There is no God, there is no purpose, once it’s over, it’s over, nothingness.” which leads to ”Well, I’m guaranteed to suffer many more shitty periods in my lifetime (death of a parent, death of siblings, breakups, stress at work etc.)” which leads to ”Well, knowing this, might as well kill myself and avoid going through all that shitty shit that lies ahead of me” and next thing you know BAM I’m on the couch not feeling like life is worth it at all. But now I can catch it right when it starts so I know what’s coming up next and it doesn’t bother me at all because the brain generates these thoughts, not ”me”. I don’t want them, I don’t like them, they drain me of my energy because they get me so emotionally invested in them.
Now when the cycle starts up I think ”Ok brain, go ahead and try to figure out the meaning of life, it’s not like mankind has been trying to come up with an answer for that since the beginning of time but I’m sure that YOU have a shot….moron…. and I bet you’re going to convince me that life must be meaningless now…yep there it is…. oh I should kill myself because there’s shitty times ahead in life?…your logic sucks, there’s undoubtedly going to be more good times as well…now hush, child, I’m trying to study”.
It may seem ridiculous when you read it, but that whole process happens within a minute. And then you’re free to continue on with whatever you were doing because you’ve emotionally disconnected yourself from your thoughts so you can focus on whatever you want.
The pit of despair is an intimidating area the first few times you go into it unready, but once you spend enough time there and learn to light a campfire, it ain’t so bad. Don’t fear the fact that you’re going into the pit, you can’t stop that. But you can set yourself so that the ride is fairly smooth and not as painful as before.
@kipgoeing, Fuck me I’ve been searching for reasons not to buy that book but now I have to go out and get it. One more for the self-help shelves part of my library goddamit.
|Brandon P’naantan Pinkney|
@heedthem, I’d suggest more than anything else to be aware of these periods, when they come is it a gradual segue or is it just a full on assault when you’ve gotten that answered, go and take your spirit back through meditation or whatever spiritual practice you can think of. it is a hard ascent an takes more time, effort and motivation than most give it credit for, but you can put this all behind you, eventually.
keep your head, heart and soul as high as you can, if you truly want to get out of the cycle of suicidal ideation, it is within you power to do so, if you ever need anyone to talk to about it, I’m always up to listen
@heedthem, Everyone is different, but in my personal experience. I quit cold turkey after smoking every day, 3 times a day for months. It was about a year before I ever ended up smoking again. It’s not that bad. Quitting coffee is 20 times harder. Have a little faith in yourself.
I don’t recommend setting exceptions for yourself. Exceptions are bound to happen naturally. It’s most important to make sure that when you do make an exception, you’re using the weed and not abusing it. It should be a tool, not a crutch.
|Heed them, HEthen|
@kipgoeing, The serious suicide thoughts are less often… That’s on a horribly horrific day and is not a regular. Usually what happens is I have to choose between the blunt or drowning in aforementioned cesspool of extreme sadness and disliking of self. I feel like a Dementor paid me a visit, literally. Sucked of life without even feeling the dramatic sense of wanting to end my life. Sometimes I can’t tell if this is worse or not.
I never smoke alone, I live with my boyfriend… but I guess that still doesn’t mean I don’t smoke “ALONE” mentally.
Sorry, I haven’t elaborated much.. When I lost my job in Sept (not really directly linked, btw, because that job gave me a false sense of fulfillment and extreeeme stress and being fired is probably one of few things enabling me to be alive right now) I at first was sleeping wonderfully for the first time in my life ever, every day. I started sleeping a normal person’s schedule for the first time ever, etc. I would get sleepy around 10-11 and wake up around 8-9 naturally.
My main depression fuel is my insecurity for myself, my complete lack of confidence, and the need for friends. The finding of my friends having “betrayed” me so to speak (they didn’t really, since nothing is different than how it has been for years, but it was a terrible day for sure) is what started the giant landslide. I started growing in my depression, I could tell, and therefore lashing out and grew my isolationism. I flipflopped between hating myself and hating those people for not extending the vulnerable, genuine love I offer to so few in my life. Then I had an epiphany of the worst kind, and that sealed the deal of spiral into horrible, dark, disgusting anguish.
I have absolutely no self-worth. I pretty much hate myself and don’t like anything about myself hardly. Things that I actually do like about myself when I’m not depressed and in a more neutral state of mine are never that much liked by me at best, and feel empty. I can find almost nothing I like about myself. I guess that’s why I’m stuck in suck a loop. Being gracious to myself… feels silly at best and absolutely impossible when I’m depressed.
@shivvy, Yeah, “What is the point of life?” is a dangerous question to let into your head. I adopted two viewpoints that help be avoid getting to far lost in that sort of question.
@heedthem, Are you MY Girlfriend? She could have probably wrote this verbatim…
She got off anti-depressants recently and it was terrible. I’ve never been that high-strung in my life, and my nerves were at their wits end.
Smoking weed, if it helps you calm down, is fine. But if it doesn’t help, then don’t do it. There comes a point in most people’s “smoking career” where the weed gets pretty ugly, and has a negative effect, but up until then, you’re fine.
So what I have to say is depression is a veil. Depression blocks our view of good things, and distorts our perceptions in a certain way that we only see (and dwell) on the negative. It can come and go, and when the veil gets thick, its really tough to lift it, but it is always possible.
I’ve already wrote extensively on depression, why we have it, and what we can do about it, so I won’t go into super deep detail…
|Heed them, HEthen|
What I’m referring to is actually exactly when I DON’T know when it’s coming, and I think it’s literally impossible for me to know in the situations that I’m talking about.
This is what happens that I am just so ill-equipped to tackle.
@heedthem, Your lack of a sense of self-worth is because you buy into what your mind, or ego if you will, feeds you daily. Why do you feel no self-worth? Give me a legitimate reason as to why your are not worthwhile?
If the answer that comes to mind if because of your friends, that’s bullshit. People in this world are assholes, fact. However, their attitude towards you does not determine your self-worth. You do. If you had no one else in the world to talk to, what would you think of yourself? Probably not bad shit because you would not have anyone to make you feel like shit. Every human is worth the same as any other, and we are all (in my opinion) pretty much perfect. But we don’t feel that way because we constantly buy into the opinions of others and what we see on ads i.e we’re not fit enough, not strong enough, not pretty enough.
|Heed them, HEthen|
^^^ To add to my last post, this is why I am deleting my facebook for now since it’s the main source of these incidences.
@heedthem, This is the one thing that makes talking to someone who’s depressed difficult because when you’re depressed it’s so tough to believe in yourself. Looking back I just think ”why the fuck was that so hard to get out of? It was so easy when I think about it” but of course when I was depressed it was not easy at all, it was the toughest thing I’ve ever had to do. It IS possible for you to see thoughts coming, and it IS possible to act accordingly. But of course, my positivity is going to make you think ”FUCK YOU SHIVVY YOU DON’T KNOW I FEEL” and I know this because that’s what I was telling everyone who was trying to help me when I had my episode.
So someone deleted you off of facebook, big fucking deal. Maybe she’s jealous because of your boyfriend, maybe she feels insecure towards you, who knows. It doesn’t mean you’re not worth anything, none whatsoever.
|Heed them, HEthen|
@ijesuschrist, I seriously, seriously feel for you and your girlfriend. It is an absolutely horrible experience and it is even worse to imagine how I effect my boyfriend.
I want to cry right now, typing this, thinking about how much my boyfriend goes through on a regular basis. Cause when I’m not sunk in my wallowing, I haze out everything (with and without weed) and anything I don’t like that interacts with me is immediately met with anger and a shoving away approach. It’s terrible and I hate it but it just comes out without my thinking and then it’s already out. He is so evenly tempered and so cute and happy all the time and tries his hardest.
When I finally broke and explained to him during my last episode about my suicidal thoughts, him saying that when I don’t explain to him what’s wrong he just wants to blip out of existence. This is something completely opposite of his character. It slapped me so hard in the face and hurts so much.
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