What is your perspective on the dream world?
stonedragon, I am no expert on the Dreamtime, I know what it means to me and it is the very reason I have chosen to be a writer. If you think about the material world, it is made of energy, matter and light but what is a dream made of? Can you tie it down to matter? As in the function of the brain? Can you tie it down to energy? As in neuro functions of the brain? Is it light ricochetting around our memories and imaging processes? Is it all of the above or none of the above or a combo?
Perhaps, as I believe, it is our life force itself that creates it, even our soul if you are so inclined, pure life. If you think of an actual rock, it can be called alive if you see the quantum or metaphysical side, but in most other definitions (including the most common scientific definition) a rock is not alive, but a dream rock is a part of you, your life force.
Death is the ultimate reality, life comes from death then returns there. Death is a state of normality, it is life that is out of place, even artificial. When we sleep we enter a state of complete unconsciousness where we do not even perceive the passage of time (rather a lack of any kind of experience). This complete unconsciousness is a return to normality, death. The dreaming is the realm between waking reality and death, we travel through it to reach death. It is closer to normality than waking reality.
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
I think it was Alex who was saying how everything we see is actually the past because the light reflecting off a surface does not reach us instantly but is delayed by the speed of light. If you think about a dream, we see things but it is not light reflecting off an object like we see when we are awake. So reality we see is the past but a dream is more the present than than that reality because it (the dream) is not delayed by the speed of light. (just thought it was an interesting point to make)
My culture (Australian Aboriginal) has at it’s core a philosophy known as “the Dreaming” that states dreams and the imagination are not only another type of reality but are actually more real than reality because the dream is composed of pure life.
Interesting views..this might get a bit off topic..but some curious observations indeed!
@stonedragon: That’s a quite interesting way to think. Do you remember stuff easily? Because I’ve read that connecting images in your brain is much more powerful than just learning words by repeating them over and over, because the brain naturally thinks in connections/images. (This would support SpiralOut’s theory)
@Ray Butler: If you want to argument with the speed of light, then you also have to consider the speed of electrical signals in the brain, which is, by the way, equal to the speed of light. Of course that’s only correct if we assume that the dream is (completely) made by the brain. (There might be “dimensions” we don’t know yet)
What’s also interesting in this context is that you actually don’t see the real reality at all. What you see (feel, hear…) is the perception your mind has of the reality. (Like a filter) Therefore, by changing your mind you are changing your perception of reality (which most of us see as the reality).
Example: When you buy a new car, you suddenly see “your” car everywhere. (They were there before, too, but you didn’t realize because your mind “filtered” them out.)
Well I’m getting off topic…
My perspective towards dreams is like SpiralOut said, but that’s only because I just read that and I didn’t have any good idea before.
wow it is morning here i sit in the sun waking up slowly after my nite of dreams. im trying to integrate it all into this animal world. the dogs lay on the carpet chewing thier bones. that is the animal world. the dreams are superimposed still in my mind like a thin film so transparent over this animal reality. im integrating what both of you guys are telling me and listening to boten anna over and over. just to get into some kind of groove here.
i saw many enlightened masters in the Himalayas. i suppose you are right about what they were up to. i couldnt tell. im so naive and i never understand much of what is going on. but one was dead for three years already, and was still intact, just sitting there in meditation. his body was smelling like a rose. i guess he was in a deep dream state. slowly his hands were starting to dry up. it was a strange thing. thanks for the explanations. food for my contemplation breakfast….
@christian. ya i can remember stuff that i have seen or felt fairly easily but i forget names of things. peoples names. especially french ones baffle the hell out of me. christine and katherine i always mix those two names up! it is the number thing tho that is the worse for me.
@ray i am super interested in that dream time idea of the aboriginals. tell us more about it. i read a book once by … something chapman. see i forgot his first name. he explained it quite well. but you tell us about it please. it is super interesting to think that dreams are more real than reality of waking life. and like christian said there are dimensions we dont know yet.
I’ve read numerous theories and read many research articles on dreams and what they represent because for as long as I can recall, I’ve dreamed both vividly and lucidly. Regardless of all of this effort I’ve put in to try and understand the mystery of the dream world, I still can not base a solid personalize opinion on what they represent.
Some dreams that I have had have predicted the future while other dreams have presented their selves as a stream of metaphors flashed before my minds eye, as if to be messages bursting from within my subconscious, relative to the reality I’m living at the time. I’ve connected with spirits in my dreams, many of my dreams actually – I’ve even helped a spirit cross over from Earth bound to his “Heaven” by completing tasks that he gave me throughout a series of dreams… It’s such a controversy and all I really know is that regardless of what they are, I’m fascinated!
With that being said, I’m curious to know what your perception of dreams is? Do you find that they are subconscious messages regarding your current reality? Is the dream world a separate realm from the reality we thrive in day to day? Is it another dimension of this reality? A fantasy world? The mind’s playground? What do you think. Share some dreams if you care to.
animus do you see colors when you hear numbers and words dont look like words but images and like if i say banana to you right now you see a banana. i mean who doesnt. everyone must think like this, isnt it???
banana. what color is number three????
Physically: It’s the central nervous system’s reaction to melatonin and dmt, two chemicals that are known to cause hallucinations and which are released at night.
Mentally: Subconscious thoughts rendered as sensory input form dream worlds which we observe and experience with our ever-waking awareness.
Spiritually: It’s the separation from our animal bodies, a step into a previous stage of existence. This is my theory.
Hmm your mode of thinking sounds more like synesthesia. Whenever I hear numbers or words I see images and with them there are also structured diagrams the connect ideas(in visual images) and such. It’s really hard for me to translate my thoughts into words because everything is visual. When I think of number 3, I do see it in green though, maybe it’s just a mild form of synesthesia.
Dreams are the product of the associations your subconscious mind tends to make. Since there is (usually) no consciousness interfering, the thoughts experienced are simply the ones most probable to happen. This leads to very relevant dream constructions pertaining to the specific problems of an individual’s psyche. This characteristic of dreams makes them invaluable for uncovering imbalances of the mind as a whole that your conscious mind simply won’t acknowledge because it would be harmful to the ego (self-image) or they are unrelated to immediate survival.
animus that is why you are so philosophic and smart, to see the diagrams is really a gift. i saw that on a program about geniuses, i think they were autistic tho. im not saying you are. but one guy could do amazing hard calculations in math by seeing the numbers in realtions to each other in diagrams. perhaps you have that.! i think i have that synesthesia, i heard about it but couldnt remember what it was called.
how many of you have this syndrome. i guess it is a syndrome?
wow intense theory there manimal. i cant say i understand it. i dont understand any thing about dreams, im sorry tamara, but i am a big dreamer and it interests me incredibly. i have been writing my dreams down in books for years now and sometimes i have the same dream scenes, but the plot is different. these places are not where i live. i take a bus 23 under a freeway underpass. how are we to understand this. is this sensory imput of chemicals in my sleeping brain. who knows. or am i time travelling. or is it a parrelle life.
it seems like that. some times it seems dreams can clean your emotions. last nite i was so angry in my dream, when i woke up i had to drink water and then say whew well i got that off my heart.
so perhaps they are just having many different functions which we can not understand. i just love them that is all…
Christian, yeah I took that into account which is why I said dreams are MORE the present than awake reality. But if the place in the brain that dreams are created is the same place we process visual stimuli then no it is not limited by the speed of light because it does not have to go anywhere for us to see it.
I think dreaming is just a more primitive way of thinking. During your waking life (amazing movie) you have thoughts every second, but these are presented to you in the shape of words, ie, “I need to go to the grocery store”. However when we dream, I believe we go to a very primitive and pure way of thinking, one before language or “words” were created. So instead of this thought passing through your head as “I need to go to the grocery store”, you’ll literally see yourself going to the grocery store. Then when a gargoyle jumps from an aisle of the grocery store, it’s because that’s a new thought entering your head… about gargoyles. And as you continues to think of new thoughts there’ll be a constant flow of images. However if you were awake it would be a constant flow of words in your head.
So I’m not saying we are thinking pure and primitive thoughts, instead, we are thinking in a pure in primitive way: Imagery, before language was created.
Nothing really changes when we fall asleep, other than our human consciousness and mind being separated from our lower consciousness and mind.
This dream stuff is constantly going on, but we’re not aware of it because we are focusing too much on the material world. All these distractions and illusions that are really nothing but effects. We’re constantly dreaming, but when we’re awake we tend to focus on the animal and material aspects of being. Not everybody does this, for some people the difference between sleeping and being awake is very small, maybe even nonexistent.
Since people are so associated with their animal consciousness and mind, they feel unconscious and out of control when they sleep. When you return to human consciousness while you sleep, you have a lucid dream. When you return to human consciousness while awake, you become enlightened. When the border between the two starts to dissolve, you become a master.
Things like visualisation and emotions are simply dreams that shine through while awake even if you’re oblivious to this dream connection.
How’s that for a perspective?
that is a good point there spiralout.
i had some sensors placed on my head recently and they detected that i see images in my waking brain like people normally do in dream state.
and it is true, i barely think in words. but in colors and images. that is why i can not do math.because i get all fuddled up with the colors and shapes and can not do abstractions very well,
math is quite pshycadelic for me.
i wonder how many people here see like this. ??
but the question here is about dreams. we wonder why we have those images thundering thru , and what does it tell us about our inner impulses?
That sounds awesome, Manimal, if I understand you- when you become this master you become like an Organian on Star-Trek TOS, like pure thought, no distinction between the two so a dream you can manifest in the material waking world? Is that the next step in consciousness? Do you think people have attained this in their lives (like monks or prophets) and gone on to exist in a way beyond our perceptions?